Water Testing
Posted by valerie :)* on March 20, 2015, 3:56 pm
A water testing kit was delivered to our town yesterday and samples of water were taken from the beach area in front of the Bambu Bar, the beach area in front of Dave Dagoli’s house, the manholes in front of the Delegado Office and the crocodile viewing area as well as the lagoon itself, at the crocodile viewing area. With relief we can state that there are no coliforms or E. Coli in our ocean water testing sites. The water currently discharging from the manhole covers, however, present very high levels of both coliform and e.coli contamination. For those of you who would like the numbers they are as follows: In front of delegado office: MPN (most probable number) of coliform and e. coli is greater than 2,424 per 100 mL At the crocodile viewing area: MPN of coliform was 1696 and the e coli was greater than 2.424 per 100 mL At the crocodile swimming pool the coliform count was high (in excess of 2,424 per 100 mL) however the e.coli MPN count was 619 per 100 mL. It should be mentioned that the crocs and other cold blooded animals do not produce e. coli, however they can be carriers if they consume food contaminated by e.coli The two pictures below show the results under the black light which indicates the presence of e.coli The picture on the left shows the results for the beach area - please note there is nothing there except some murkiness. The picture on the right shows the results of the manhole water outside the delegado office - you will notice that every cell fluoresces. These results will hopefully provide a public awareness of where there is and where there is not a water related issue that would raise health concerns. The testing kit will be handed over to the committee with the hopes that this will start a process which will solve both known problems and address concerns about activities in our community. Saludos Valerie Denford Larry Field Andrew Morrow | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Vicki and Robin on March 20, 2015, 4:31 pm, in reply to "Water Testing" 201.138.181.26
THANK YOU!!! Thank you for reporting on this and doing it in the first place. Thank you! | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by mary s on March 20, 2015, 4:43 pm, in reply to "Water Testing" 189.164.245.118
Thank you so much Val for doing this very needed testing My understanding is that you paid for these tests out of pocket and this was not a cheap thing for you to do. Can you share with us the cost for the kits please, I for one would like to contribute towards paying for this and keep it going. thank you mary shanti | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Mayama on March 20, 2015, 5:01 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.250.186
Sounds like a good report. Thank you for doing the testing. I'm wondering what kind of water testing method was used and if it takes into account the dilution factor when the sewage runs into the ocean. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Larry F on March 20, 2015, 8:11 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.203.235
To be clear on this, this was a scientific test in that it used proper equipment and testing procedures to test for levels of coliform and ecoli in various parts of the non-tap water in the community. There was no attempt to interpret the results - this is the work of people more qualified. The tests indicate no recordable levels of coniform or ecoli in the waters on the beach ...... in the two areas tested. Dilution of the water from the lagoon or sewer overflow as it enters the ocean is a given. The important fact is that the testing of the ocean waters indicate completely safe waters for swimminig. The sewage overflow on the streets is definately sewage. Whether or not it presents a health risk is not within the scope of this testing. Many thanks to Valerie for initiating and paying for these tests. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Erin on March 20, 2015, 10:37 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 187.148.170.84
I for one am prepared to put my $$$$ where my mouth was when making my observations of which have now been confirmed, there is poop in the lagoon regardless if you like to believe it or not. I was amazed that few people actually believe my comments regarding the smell however now that it is confirmed. I will be supporting Valerie in recovering some of the costs associated with the testing equipment. I hope others who commented do the same as she showed the initiative in doing as compared to talking....thank you Valerie. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Daniel H on March 21, 2015, 1:01 am, in reply to "Water Testing" 189.164.217.49
A very big thank you Valerie, Larry and Andrew, outstanding! | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Kim on March 21, 2015, 6:29 am, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 198.144.53.21
Have you compared your samples with the test that was done in 2009-2010? | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Kim on March 23, 2015, 6:26 am, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 198.144.53.21
The information that we ask for concerning the 2009-10 test reports have never posted. I received an e-mail asking if we knew anything about coliform levels but that was all. I have forward the e-mail to Valerie so she can contact the people with the test information. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by mark on March 21, 2015, 9:59 am, in reply to "Water Testing" 67.160.231.215------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by DanH on March 21, 2015, 11:04 am, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 187.148.142.124
"Enterococci are a subgroup within the fecal streptococcus group. Enterococci are distinguished by their ability to survive in salt water, and in this respect they more closely mimic many pathogens than do the other indicators. Enterococci are typically more human-specific than the larger fecal streptococcus group. EPA recommends enterococci as the best indicator of health risk in salt water used for recreation and as a useful indicator in fresh water as well." http://water.epa.gov/type/rsl/monitoring/vms511.cfm I suggest you all read this reference carefully as it details the proper method for determining beach pollution. Quickie test kits do not produce reliable results. E Coli testing is not reliable for beach water testing as explained above. You have confirmed human waste flowing via the lagoon onto the beach in close proximity to where people are swimming. The pathogens that are found in sewage, such as salmonella, can and will persist in seawater for days. The fact that you used a quickie test kit that do3sn't test for the right indicator organism should not delude you into thinking this flow of sewage is somehow miraculously and instantly being absorbed and neutralized. Any public health officer would look at that overflowing sewage and close this beach immediately until it was stopped and sufficient time has passed for certain pathogen die off, about 4 days. At this time, there are not a lot of fully proven methods for quick and accurate beach water testing. Here are several: http://www.beachapedia.org/Rapid_Indicators_for_Beach_Water_Testing
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Posted by Larry F on March 21, 2015, 12:26 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.203.235
Dan, your point about enterococci is valid.. These tests confirm where there is a presence of total coliforms and E.coli bacteria only. You are judging the reliability of test procedures used however knowing what test was actually used here. The testing, for those scientifically inclined, was a multi-tube fermentation method which required a 24 hour incubation period to grow the bacteria. It is considered reliable for the testing of fresh water. However, it does not test, as Dan points out, for enterococci, which has the ability to thrive in sea water, where E.coli thrives poorly. This does not negate the value of testing for E.coli on the beach, particularly when the test samples were taken close to the sewage discharge. I would suggest that the lack of E.coli suggests a relatively high level of dilution of of the contaminated water. As well, It should be said that the presence of fecal contamination determines a "potential for disease" only. Nevertheless the presence of E.coli does strongly suggest the presence of pathogenic organisms, and therefore should be a cause for concern. No claims are being made that the beach waters are totally safe for recreational use, particularly at this time of heavy storm water runoff. But they do test negative for total coliforms and E.coli bacteria. Hopefully the further testing of waters by more sophisticated proceesses throw more light on the picture. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Daniel H on March 21, 2015, 12:33 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" Edited by board administrator March 21, 2015, 1:22 pm------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by jane henderson on March 21, 2015, 2:07 pm, in reply to "Water Testing" 187.148.172.46
Thanks so much for doing this! I would also like share in the expense. TheRe is now a "water" jug at the Helping Hands Bookstore to collect contributions from anyone who might wish to help defray the cost. Has anyone actually become sick from swimming in the bay? I haven't been in since the last storm but was in pretty regularly before that and did not get ill. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by DanH on March 21, 2015, 4:13 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 187.148.142.124
http://www.beachapedia.org/Health_Threats_from_Polluted_Coastal_Waters Previous Message Transworld Surf has published an article Seven Surf Sicknesses which are actually a mixture of illnesses and the pathogens that cause illnesses. Their list is: MRSA, Hepatitis A, Encephalitis and Meningitis, Gastroentiritis, Vibrio Vulnificus, Leptospirosis, and Unknown and Bizarre illnesses. Personal examples of extreme health effects from exposure to polluted runoff and/or sewage spills include: Chris O'Connel had a cut on his arm and went in Mission Bay, San Diego after a rain event. His arm became infected with the Streptococcus bacteria and he almost died. Three operations and two and half weeks in the hospital saved his life. A member of the Long Beach Chapter of Surfrider Foundation became infected with the same bacteria after surfing near the San Gabriel River Mouth. Charles Moore of Long Beach was also hospitalized for two weeks. A long-time Surfrider Legal Issues Team member nearly had to have his foot amputated after a blister (and subsequent surfing) turned into a nasty MRSA infection (see Staph Infections). Mike Rhodes, another long-time Surfrider Legal Issues Team member, developed a massive ear infection and build-up of fluid in the inner ear after surfing in Del Mar, CA after a rain. A young surfer was reportedly diagnosed with Bell's Palsey after surfing in the Cardiff, CA area shortly after a rain event. Surfer Timmy Turner nearly died after an aggressive staph infection attacked his brain.
BTW, the sewage is still running into the lagoon and from there to the beach areas.
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Posted by Daniel H on March 21, 2015, 4:43 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" Edited by board administrator March 21, 2015, 8:17 pm
After your last post where you once again made assumptions when data (type of test kit) was easily available the value of your opinion means little to me. I think you may have some valid points but they are buried under a layer of fear mongering bullshit. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Larry F on March 21, 2015, 5:03 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.203.235
There are some very polluted beaches on the California coast. One might wonder why anyone would swim in them. Here is some advice from a health authority in California? 1. "After a rain storm wait at least three days before going into the water. 2. Swim at least 100 yards away from a flowing storm drain outlet. 3. Avoid puddles in front of storm drains." If anyone in La Manzanilla is concerned about the sewers, maybe don't wade through the puddle in front of the Delegado. And maybe don't swim too close to the lagoon when it is flowing. Kinda common sense.
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Posted by mark on March 21, 2015, 5:04 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 107.199.77.57
In 1955 Katharine Hepburn performed a fall into a canal in Venice, Italy as part of David Lean's production "Summertime". She developed a chronic eye infection as a result, which persisted the rest of her life. I returned from a visit to La Manzanilla back in March 2012 with an eye infection which persists today, in spite of treatment. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Daniel H on March 21, 2015, 5:19 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.217.49
Sorry about that Mark. Another Katherine Hepburn story from African Queen. "To show her disgust with the amount of alcohol that John Huston and Humphrey Bogart consumed during filming, Katharine Hepburn drank only water. As a result, she suffered a severe bout of dysentery". and "Sources claimed that everyone in the cast and crew got sick except Humphrey Bogart and John Huston, who said they avoided illness by essentially living on imported Scotch. Bogart later said, "All I ate was baked beans, canned asparagus, and Scotch whisky. Whenever a fly bit Huston or me, it dropped dead."" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0043265/trivia?item=tr0755098
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Posted by Red on March 21, 2015, 8:43 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 187.148.40.27
So drink plenty of Scotch, don't surf in California, avoid puddles. Got it, easy enough. Rojo | ------------------------RE: Health
Posted by Kim on March 22, 2015, 6:34 am, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 198.144.53.21
A guy earlier this yr. had to go home because he was having health issues. After returning home and having surgery they found him to have e-coli from the report I was told by his relative. Interesting to know if it had anything to do with La Manz. | ------------------------Re: RE: Health
Posted by valerie :)* on March 22, 2015, 8:21 am, in reply to "RE: Health"
Kim - I sent you a personal email yesterday regarding your comments about an earlier test taking if you knew who took those tests so I could find those results. As yet you have not returned that email. Would you kindly post that information on the message board? thank you, Valerie | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Linda Mandala on March 22, 2015, 12:10 pm, in reply to "Water Testing" 189.164.209.216
MANY THANKS to everyone who is trying hard to find out the real info on our water pollution problem. I have not swam once this year here just because the smell of all that stuff going into the ocean makes me think it has to be worse than it looks. It is wonderful that we are finally getting some real info obviously we do need more and looks like we are on the right tracks. We are lucky to have a few really knowledgeable people here who can help us understand and interpret the FACTS so we do understand what is really going on and not ride on suppositons and fear, or ignore the obvious either. thanks again everyone for allyou are doing. Linda Mandala | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Tom Gillespie on March 23, 2015, 10:37 am, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 70.209.99.171
Mary JO did beach water testing about 8 years ago in LaManz. I don't recall exactly what the results were but I decided, based on the results, I would no longer swim anywhere south of the cemetery. As I recall, the test results differed depending on when the test sample was taken in relation to the tide. Incoming tide was bad, outgoing good or the other way around. What say you, Mary Jo? | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Larry F on March 23, 2015, 11:46 am, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.203.235
Interesting comment. Eight years ago pre-dated the existing sewer system. If the beach waters tested positive for coliform or Ecoli back then, the question at the time likely was - where was it coming from? Last week the beach water tested negative for coliform and Ecoli. This, of course, does not rule out the existence of other pathogens in the water, although it is likely that coliform and Ecoli would present themselves along with other contaminents. It is important to keep in mind that not all strains of Ecoli present a health risk, although some strains do. Rather, the presence of coliform and ecoli are indicators that disease bearing pathogens could also be present. The answers to all these questions are hopefully on their way. | ------------------------Re: Water Testing
Posted by Linda Mandala on March 23, 2015, 2:20 pm, in reply to "Re: Water Testing" 189.164.209.216
Before the sewer system the beach and town was full of old decrepit septic systems. when the tide comes in it obviously comes up enough and would be taking a lot of shit (literally) from those septics back into the ocean. That seems logical to me....hence, lots of bacteria being taken out every tide. just sayin" Linda Mandala | ------------------------
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